TVShowsOnDVD.com is reporting that, contrary to most expectations, Fox will release the first season of WKRP IN CINCINNATI in April 2007. Unsurprisingly, there will be music substitutions, but Fox is said to be making efforts to ensure that the replacements fit in.

I'll reserve judgment until the extent of the replaced music becomes clearer, but it's probably a minor miracle that the show's even being released at all.

Dave

Well, it's going to be impossible to do any substitution in the wonderful episode where the Falwell/Robertson - like preacher is railing against rock music and they oppose him with John Lennon's "Imagine."

One of my favorite 'message' episodes of the entire series.

...when Johhny Fever sings along to Van Morrison's CARAVAN:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5f3mnJKaI0

Marty, thanks for that link!

What a wonderful moment.

Yeah, I just can't see the charm of WKRP surviving with "music substitutions."

I don't believe they actually use any of the song, Imagine in that particular episode. They merely quote lines from it. The preacher complains the song says there's no heaven then Carlson says no it only says Imagine there's no heaven. They might still cut even the spoken lyrics as Fox did on the recent St. Elsewhere DVD release when a character quoted another song, Insant Karma. I don't recall if the syndicated version of this episode changed or cut these lines for WKRP like they did with Elton John's Tiny Dancer.

It's probably a licensor who refuses to give up the rights no matter what the cost. Who owns these songs/lyrics of John's today? Is Yoko involved?

There are literally hundreds of songs in the 'KRP seasons that would cost millions of dollars in fees if all the parties involved cooporated. Not bloody likely. :(

An early review is out, with a complete list of music cuts and replacements, and the news is not good at all:

WKRP DVD not OK

Now that the details are known, I doubt I'll be getting this. As is usual when something like this happens, there are a few comments from people concerned that if sales of season 1 are lackluster, then Fox won't release any further seasons. Well, if they're all going to be hacked up as much as season 1 appears to have been, I can't say I'll be losing much sleep over that possibility.

Dave

Christ! Don't waste your money...

Wasn't this music issue the same as what happened with SCTV discs - though they eventually released SCTV, the sets are high-priced - because of the music?

The SCTV set still has a few music substitutions, but I could live with them. The only one that's really glaring is when the Schmenge brothers perform their salute to John Williams...although they aren't playing Williams' music anymore! The Fishin' Musician's theme is different too.

Happily for me, I have the entire WKRP run with the original music, but I would have upgraded to better transfers. Not now, though. Can you imagine Les Nessman getting ready for his big date without "Hot Blooded"?

I've seen a couple of postings stating that in addition to the music changes, some of the episodes are the truncated syndication versions as well.

I'm not a big fan of this series, but if I was I'd avoid this release for sure. This kind of thing isn't at all acceptable.

Blasphemy, man. Johnny Fever will sic the phone cops on you. :)

More on the WKRP fiasco:

WKRP In Cincinnati: Requiem For A Masterpiece

I was going to buy this to rent out. People will be curious enough to rent the first disc, but now I'm thinking that I'm going to pass.

Are the artists themselves fans of the show? I'm sure some are, and if the creators of the dvd took the time, they could have possibly had a few of them agree to lower royalties. Pink Floyd might not go for it, but what does Foreigner have to lose?


marc

I don't know...maybe accepting lower royalties would dilute the awesome power of the Foreigner belt. :lol:

A lot of these bands may not own their songs. The record companies, labels, may own them and since these are the people that have decided that suing grandmothers, children and like is sound business I don't think they're willing to listen to reason. The studios aren't angels either. This is just a case where literally everyone loses.

It's interesting to compare the cases of WKRP vs. Happy Days' respective DVD releases. According to this review of Happy Days season 2 at Sitcoms Online, Paramount spent the staggering sum of almost $1 million just to clear the rights for all of the music used in the season 1 set. Sales were disappointing, so for the season 2 set, instrumental music was used to replace much of the original music. I remember thinking that the season 1 set was overpriced when it was first released - now I know why. By the time you factor in all the other production costs in addition to the music, they'd probably have to sell at least 40,000-50,000 copies just to break even.

It comes down to the publishers. Most rock musicians by this point in rock and roll wrote their own songs and didn't sign their rights away, so the songwriter would receive half of the revenue.


I still believe that if the dvd set was released by someone passionate about the project, they would have taken the time to approach the artists or publishers, and have at least secured the rights to songs in key scenes.



marc

We all think like fans here, which we're supposed to do, but if we were running these businesses I think we'd suddenly see more justification for choices like this -- at the lower level, we're seeing the real dedicated companies like Blue Underground and No Shame probably realizing that all the effort (which costs) put into marginal releases is resulting in lots of positive fan response...and lots of red ink, or at least frustration to the point that Lustig is clearly saying he wants out of the business.

Now, while a smaller company may make the effort to do something right a conglomerate wouldn't, why do we think WKRP would be such a great seller? It's a great show; so is TAXI, BOB NEWHART, HILL STREET BLUES and MARY TYLER MOORE (and general consensus, not necessarily yours, puts those shose even on a slightly higher plane than WKRP), and all those MTM shows apparently aren't selling well enough; rumor has it NEWHART has no future seasons planned, HILL STREET stalled at season 2, MARY stalled at one, restart, and is stalling again -- I simply don't know the numbers, but I do wonder if we sometimes take our personal passion and assume everyone else has the same passion. I wonder myself if TAXI (my favorite of the aformentioned shows) is stalled because of the prominent use of Billy Joel's VIENNA in the first episode of the 4th season, and they're having rights clearance issues. Regardless, if it was selling enough for them to justify release, I suspect they would do it. While, what, 10% of WKRP may be wrecked by the edits (and I'm more outraged at the syndication cuts on a few episodes), I guess 90% of what made the show great is still there; this "don't release" it vibe seems valiant but pointless, because if they never release it, how is that better? For the fans or the actors whose work should be seen?

It's incredibly frustrating, but as long as there are lawyers and money to be made people will take advantage of whatever situations they have, apparently. I agree, it seems to me like these songs in these episodes are only free advertising for the music, but musicians and publishing groups and lawyers disagree.

On the other hand, Shout Factory presumably had success with FREAKS & GEEKS and SCTV (both of which suffered music cuts), and I'd have to assume WKRP would sell just as well as they did.

I've mentioned this before, but I'd be curious to know what kind of market research DVD companies and studios use to judge what films/TV shows they should/should not release. I'm guessing the answer is either none or not very good.

Why do we presume anything? All the SCTVs boxes have shown up heavily discounted on some liquidator site, which can only mean many copies they had hoped to sell at a higher price they had to sell for cents on the dollar...whether they sold enough to ultimately make a decent profit, I can't say. Is there any SCTV still to be released?


I never said WKRP "couldn't" sell well, obviously people release a show because they hope it will sell. Why ROCKFORD FILES sells while KOJAK or McCLOUD don't I couldn't tell you (well, I like ROCKFORD better myself, but...). But several MTM shows (WHITE SHADOW is another one that seems to have stumbled before the finishing line) have had difficult runs of it on DVD apparently, so the cursory evidence regarding 20-30 year old intelligent television one might look at is hardly encouraging...what MTM shows have, in fact, made their entire season count? REMINGTON STEELE did, but that had Pierce Brosnan, still a movie star.

I assume the with-music versions that are out there illegally are still from cut syndication versions, correct? Or are they pristine full-length original-run episodes?

Well, Shout Factory kept putting out one SCTV box set after another. I have to assume that wouldn't have happened unless they were selling well. At this point, all of the NBC 90-minute shows are on DVD, plus a box set of "Best Of" earlier syndication episodes. So there's still some material left to release, but I think most fans would agree that the "best" stuff is already out.

The reason ROCKFORD and COLUMBO outsell KOJAK and MCCLOUD seems obvious: they're among the best television shows ever produced. Plus, I have seen "trailers" for these releases on several Universal movies, but I don't remember ever seeing one for BAA BAA BLACK SHEEP. I think the problem with those Universal sets is that a whole bunch of them got released at about the same time: ADAM-12, DRAGNET, BAA BAA BLACK SHEEP, MCMILLAN AND WIFE. Who could afford to buy all of these sets at the same time? So what happened is that customers thought, "Well, I'll get ROCKFORD and COLUMBO and save the 2nd and 3rd-tier stuff for later." Maybe later came, probably it didn't.

I admit that the (presumed) failure of THE MARY TYLER MOORE SHOW on DVD (and, to some extent, THE BOB NEWHART SHOW) is a mystery to me. That's one reason I'd love to learn more about the studio's marketing research. Why did they think MTM would sell? TAXI and BARNEY MILLER seem forgotten today, for some reason (and TAXI never had good ratings anyway); my theory is that NIGHT COURT, an obvious MILLER ripoff, supplanted BARNEY in the public's collective mind.

This I can shed some light on from a "rentailer" point of view...

For some reason or another, the classic tv shows just don't rent, at least at the rate of more recent programs. I rent them out per disc. Disc one of DUKES OF HAZZARD SEASON 1 has rented about 50 times. Disc two has rented maybe 10 times, and the third maybe once or twice.

I feel that after getting 4 - 10 hours of nostalgia, the customer has had their fill, and do not commit to the rest of the season. They might rent a disc for a party as well. Also, a lot of the classic shows don't have the story arc that is so prevelant in tv shows today, like LOST or THE WIRE or THE SOPRANOS. The customer goes not get involved with the show.

Granted some do well, like THE TWILIGHT ZONE and THE PRISONER, but I can see why some studios are reluctant to release a whole series. That still didn't stop me from buying BOSOM BUDDIES or HAWAII FIVE-O!


marc